Thursday 30 July 2009

Is it possible to add a third faction?

Is it too late? Probably. Would it be a bad time to try? Probably :P It would require huge redevelopment and of course would turn everything on its head. But lets live in dreamland for a moment, if Mythic were to try and add another faction are there actually any real options?

I reckon with a shit load of work, time and effort it could be done. So on to the big question....
How to adapt the campaign for a third faction?
The existing system could still work, but have a third VP scoreline and a third branch of zones from each central zone (Praag for example).
First off lets quickly make up a faction. I'm going to go with one called Nature with Lizardmen, Wood Elves and Bretonnians. Now lets attach Wood Elf zones to Praag.
If a faction locks the central zone, then both of the other factions zones become attackable and remain so until the central zone is contested again.
If either of those zones then lock (to which ever enemy faction), the fortress is then attackable.

Taking it further and sticking with one city each (boo hiss), if your faction takes 2 forts from another faction you then get to attack their city.

But what if the attack on Nature's fortress failed, Order locked Reikland and then pushed on Praag whilst Destruction was attacking Loren Forests? Uh oh! Destruction's attack has been cut off and now they face a difficult choice.

Continue their attack on Nature's fortress or risk Order locking Praag and pushing into the Chaos Wastes.
Oh my, what's this? A far less linear and more dynamic campaign? Actual options to cut off supply lines and isolate the enemy? Well, I think so anyway...

Riddled with flaws? Probably, but then maybe something like this could be fitted into WAR. Dark Age of Camelot showed us how well 3 factions works, it prevents one side dominating and keeping the campaign fresh and exciting. Those of us that played DAoC have struggled to understand why Mythic didn't do the same again here.
When Mythic starts looking at major expansions, perhaps they should start reconsidering that missing faction.


  1. Interesting idea, much more in detail than other "hey just add a 3rd faction" posts.

  2. It's an interesting concept.. Actually one of the best I've seen proposing a third faction.

    After all I think that a 3rd faction may be interesting, but WAR has several severe issues which aren't solved by it and which are more important..

  3. Thanks guys :)

    Zizlak, absolutely. I don't think there's one magic fix that will solve all the issues with WAR, certainly this wouldn't sort out performance, etc. This was just an idea for sorting the issues from having only 2 factions.

    As for everything else... uhm :D

  4. Very nice!

    Like the other posters, this is pretty well thought out. At this juncture you don't need all the details. You've outlined a pretty solid idea.

    Would the Forces of Nature oppose the other two? So the Wood Elves & Bretonnia would fight against High Elves and the rest of Order rather than ally with them against Destruction?

    Dare I say a different faction that would be more apt to oppose both Order and Destruction? The Forces of Disease? Skaven, Nurgle, and Beastmen.

    I love your idea though ... Forces of Nature. That is awesome!!!

    Or screw it ... add both! Forces of Nature vs. Forces of Disease. They could push back and forth between Skavenblight and the Bretonnian capital of Couronne.

    With four it could lead to uneasy alliances or live events where alliances would flip. Or there could just be all-out war with all four factions against each other.

    Tell me that wouldn't stoke people to come back or to try this game. Fix the current end game campaign and add two new realms? Sounds good by waaaaay out of scope.

    Were there three realms in DAOC from the start? I'd think that somewhere behind the scenes Mythic had some sort of contingency plan for rolling in a new realm. Right? Right? I would.

  5. Well the only problem i see in that model is that you can ally with any one if you have push like destro in pic 3 then order cant attack nature so you are forced to ally with nature... So you are going to fight one enemy if you not are in Praag then you can fight 2.
    So say that destro and nature are allys to attack order and nature locks the zone you cant join the fight in the next zone becouse your ally have forced you back to CW. Nature are fighting alone in reikland with destro trying to lock cw... Of course you have 2 other parings to fight in but you will still have this conflict.

  6. Hmmm, good point. Perhaps if in pic 3 as Order you could still travel to and lock the Nature zone, essentially side stepping Destruction. So if a zone is attackable, it's attackable by anyone.

    Might be a bit chaotic mind you. Though perhaps that wouldn't be a bad thing ;)

  7. Due to the nature of how the lands are actually joined together in game. RVR zone sitting between the PVE zones. I believe the only viable options are the Skaven, since you could effectively dump their lands underneath the ORvR/PvE zones. So you could have their entrances to the ORvR zones come up under. This would minimise the restructing of the current PvE/ORvR.

    Given they are underground, this would allow more flexiability in hiding the joins, where lands had to be bumped together.

    I think the challenge would be increasing the ORvR space underground, enough to incorporate the keeps/fortresses of this 3rd race. We already have vast ORvR spaces which don't get used (Though this opportunity would allow a restructing).

    I would potentially open up the 1st stage of a city take to 2 opposing realms, since effectively the skaven could hold one of your fortresses and say destruction held the other 2. Then once stage 1 was done, only 1 of the attacking realms would go through to stage 2. Though I think that would have to have some serious thought about balancing issues.

    I think the only real problem we have, is the amount of work involved in this massive undertaking going to justify the return in people, or would it just shift the people around.

    Also creating the 3rd faction, could in just result in an underpowered 3rd realm. We all know how hard it is to let go of characters and given the zerg like nature of the end game, if the 3rd realm struggled to put together a warband, how long would realistically survive.

    Personally this would have to be an Addon, but it would potentially be the most dynamic change to a MMO via an addon, we would have seen, a real earthshaker.

    It's good to see this idea still ticking along though.


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